Yesterday I sat down with Cherie Duffey to ask her questions about children’s ministry at NewSpring. That included a great explanation of why we require kids to worship with kids and adults to worship with adults. Among other things, we also chatted about the benefits and challenges of working on staff with her husband. Here’s the interview with Cherie.
Agree that being relevant to kids vs. adults is important (and that multi-site service recording/showing somewhat requires a stance like this), but there is one problem with not allowing any kids in the adult worship – it goes directly against passages like Deut 6:7-9 and Psalm 78:1-8.
We must ALWAYS remember that parents are the ones who are to bring about the spiritual formation of kids and we can partner with them. By not “allowing” parents to take their children with them into service, you alienate a large number of families and kids. Given that, I realize it is a choice you are making as a ministry leadership, so this is just some food for thought…
dean, i love those passages. and, if the only time i could tell my kids stories was during one hour on sunday morning, i would agree with you. the fact is, though, that there are times that are much more conducive to these conversations with my kids.
there’s a reason why we don’t send five-year-olds to high school. 18-year-olds learn differently and need different teaching than five-year-olds. same principle holds true on sunday mornings.
we just need to begin looking at our faith and the Bible as more than a one-hour experience on sunday morning.
tony
Of course faith and God’s Word is more than just one hour on a Sunday morning, you’re preaching to the choir on that one; but if I choose as a parent to worship with my kids, and then told I cannot at New Spring, what kind of message does that send to families who would like to do so?
Now granted, as a children’s director, I continue to provide quality, engaging, relevant and deep CM programming (which you can check out at http://www.colonialwoodsmc.com); but when I heard Cherie say “We don’t allow kids in our adult worship services,” as a parent I gringed. Once again, purposeful choice – but you will loose a great number of families (even visitors) because of that decision alone.
Dean
dean, it sends the message that we believe in kids so much that we’re willing to create an amazing experience just for them.
yes, we lose a few families along the way, but we gain a lot more in the long run. why? because adults are able to experience a service on adult topics without distraction while kids experience services on kid topics that they can enjoy.
i know. it’s counter-intuitive. you’d think our ministry would experience better results if we tried to make everyone happy. the opposite is true. there are hundreds of great churches around here that will let you bring their kids into the service. if that’s a high value, we’ll encourage folks to attend one of those churches. we’ve decided to take a different approach and communicate to adults like adults and kids like kids. because of that, we have families attending in record numbers.
btw… i’m not suggesting that the way you do ministry to kids is wrong or not biblical. it’s just different than the way we do it.
tony
“btw… i’m not suggesting that the way you do ministry to kids is wrong or not biblical. it’s just different than the way we do it.”
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I did not think this at all, just some intellectual discourse. And sorry if I have come across to strong, I get pretty passionate about this topic (father of 5, discipling parent who takes his role seriously).
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“we’ve decided to take a different approach and communicate to adults like adults and kids like kids. because of that, we have families attending in record numbers.”
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I would encourage your church leadership to seek out opportunities, then, to engage families to get them to worship together when they can. It is rather unfortunate that our churches today see kids as “distractions” rather than disciples who, while still growing, have the same amount of the very same Holy Spirit that “we adults” do. The example of Jesus welcoming kids despite how the culture viewed them “as distractions” is quite striking. Jesus did not have a separate children’s ministry section of the mountain side while teaching.
As far as record numbers of families attending New Spring, I would venture to say it is related to the root of the problem: that kids “get in the way” of true worship. I simply and heartedly disagree.
Not trying to convince you or anyone else, but trying and encourage people to process through the messages sent and the theological basis of those decisions – aside of what simply makes sense and is most convenient.
God Bless, Dean
Wow, great convo guys!!
One of my favorite parts of what I get to do is talk to the first time families that have visited us on Sunday at our Greenville Campus! It’s so refreshing to hear their stories and where God has brought them and what they thought of their NewSpring experience.
For me, what’s even cooler is when I get to talk to a family that was not in line with our vision on “age appropriate worship” (adults in their service, kids in theirs). You’d think they would be totally livid when I call, but ironically by the time we talk Monday their position has totally changed! For them, their kids loved it and begged to come back and that FLOORS them!! They actually keep coming back!
Are there still a few families along the way that lave? Sure, and I hate to see that but in the end, it’s their choice to leave. For us, this is the vision God has given us and He’s proved it works for us and the family!
thanks! :)
pudge
“For us, this is the vision God has given us and He’s proved it works for us and the family!”
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Really? This vision honestly came from God through his revealved Word and through the inspiration of the Spirit? What was the process that tool place when this decision was made? Who made it? How big was the church at that point?
Granted, I would like nothing more than to have as many kids in the CM of my church as possible (and typically I see about 20-25 kids in the service with their parents, we typically run 230 kids B-5th Grade), but telling parents they cannot bring their kids into the service is a little bit like “Big Brother” and even bigger government.
I find it difficult to rectify NewSpring’s stance with the Godly design of the family, marriage and raising spiritual champions.
Thanks Pudge for joining in. I’ve followed your blog for a while now.
Dean
ok. i’m stopping the back and forth. dean, you’re not going to be convinced that our way is right. we’re not going to be convinced that your way is right. that’s because there is no “right” on this topic.
this isn’t a theological issue. this is a question of methodology. the good news is that we can disagree on methodology and still be friends.
tony
I can’t see the video so I don’t know what is actually said. Does Newspring say that parents can’t bring their children to worship with them…. like CAN’T or shouldn’t?
I am the staff guy who has the long chat with people who are in the process of joining our fellowship. Part of the conversation always centers around the “spiritual/church history/background/experience. I recently had one of those conversations with a young woman who “grew up in church” with her parents and a couple siblings. SHE HATED IT! She resented being dragged into the worship service, was bored to tears, and hated it that her mother always ended up taking her out and spanking her for her misbehavior. As soon as she was old enough and independent enough she stopped attending church at all, and was away for about 15 years. She loved Jesus, but wasn’t so crazy about His church.
The funny thing is I know the church she grew up in- it’s a great church; wonderful preaching, exceptional music, and an outstanding Children’s Ministry. It is all that today and has been for as long as I have known anything about them. So, I would have to say that our new member’s opinion had nothing to do with the church- it had everything to do with an inappropriate approach- her parent’s, NOT the church. The church had an age appropriate environment where she could have actually learned how much God loves her, but she never got to experience that, in favor of learning how upset she made God by wiggling in her seat while in the midst of something she really didn’t understand.
Just saying…
I totally understand the position that Newspring has. Our church chooses to allow parents to keep their children in the services while preschoolers can attend a special service and 1-3 grade children have yet another special service during the sermon. As a father, I watch my 6 year old during the occasions that he is in the “Big Church”. He draws or colors, does math or gets fidgety. On the other hand, during the services planned for his age group he is apparently engaged. He comes home talking about the Bible and it lasts through the week. I teach high school and lead youth. People of every age need to be challenged at their level.
I won’t argue for or against you, but I will say that I feel the children are best served through age oriented worship and learning. By the way, learning about God is part of our goal isn’t it. Family time, while awesome, should be going on every day, not just during your church services.
[...] Watch the following video from Tony Morgan (on staff at Newspring)… interview with Cherie. WPvideo [...]
[...] get really upset when I hear of churches REQUIRING parents to send their kids to an entirely different service. As a matter of fact, it would probably seal the decision for me to not attend that [...]